I know that, but in this case her weakness is fire, and that’s probably because that’s what Chie’s weakness is. My comment wasn’t about whether or not Shadow Chie’s weakness is fire, which it clearly is in this case… it’s how he knew to use fire on her.
Personally I am amazed how things can be messed up so badly in only a minute. Most of the 3rd episode was fine but the Pyro Jack thing was just ridiculous. Also, Yu being able to summon other Persona is all well and good but him just pulling them for nothing isn’t doing it for me.
Pulling out a level 32 fire Persona against a boss that’s supposed to be weak to wind and not fire is just bad. You should be level 5 at that point, if that. Stupid.
They were obviously trying to pander to Pyro Jack fans by using him, which seemed to work, but it was so badly misplaced. Could have picked a better place for it. The fact that he even had the Persona for apparently no good reason is seriously bugging me, too. If they had bothered to show him getting it in a shuffle or fusion maybe I wouldn’t mind but nope.
Honestly, if they weren’t going to pay any attention to what level things are or even change elements then why not just go big and use Surt, or better yet, Mada?
Well, whatever. Despite those issues the rest of the episode was pretty good. It ended where I figured it would. Them leaving because Chie was tired. Suspect Shadow Yukiko is next. Didn’t see anything in the preview to indicate Avenging Knight will show up but that could still happen, I suppose.
Hm… well then…
Long Version:
Personally, I’m amazed how you can get so upset over something so trivial as this. Sure it’s true that Pyro Jack is a high level persona that, in accordance with the game, Yu shouldn’t have. But then again… This isn’t the game, and the sooner you realize that, the sooner things like this will stop bothering you. Besides, I don’t think the idea here was to “pander to Pyro Jack fans” with this… It’s more likely because he’s one of the Jack Brothers, and the most obvious choice in the situation (more on that later).
Anyway, you need to stop looking at this show like it has to follow the same mechanics as the game it’s based off of. This isn’t a game, it’s a TV show, and there are certain limitations that TV shows have that are absent in a video game.
You can’t expect the anime to be exactly like the game, it’s impossible. There’s a lot of story to be told in a very limited amount of time. If they stuck to the mechanics of the game for each and every little thing, then they wouldn’t be able to tell the story in the amount of time they’ve been given. And that’s what they’re doing here, they’re recreating the story that the game tells, they’re not recreating the game. If they have to change unimportant details in order to get points across, then so be it.
Game mechanics have to be changed in order to make up for the lack of time they have… It’s quite evident that Social Links play some part in the anime, but how much I’m not entirely sure yet. In the game the Main Character would have to fuse Personas, and he would have to be a particular level before being able to fuse certain personas. However, in the anime there isn’t enough time to be wasted on fusion, and there doesn’t appear to be any experience or leveling system in place, so rather than wasting time with all of that, Yu seems to be able to summon personas based on the Social Links that he has formed.
The purpose of him changing Personas here, is to show the audience that he is special, and therefore able to change Personas at will, while others are only able to use one Persona. In episode 2, he formed the Magician Social Link, therefore, if the above theory is correct, he can summon magician personas. Why did they choose Pyro Jack? Well that’s hard to say, but my guess would be that even though Shadow Chie’s weakness is WIND, Chie’s weakness is FIRE. Jiraiya can already cast WIND spells, so it would be pointless to summon another persona that casts WIND. However, they still need to emphasize the fact that Yu is not limited to only using Izanagi. So FIRE seems like the optimal choice in this situation… it eliminates the repetition of two Wind based Personas on the field, shows that Yu can summon different Personas, and using the FIRE elemental type is still slightly relevant since it’s Chie’s weakness… after all… they are both Chie.
So they’ve decided that Shadow Chie’s weakness is now FIRE… we need a Persona of the Magician Arcana that is fire based… Of all of the fire based Personas, Pyro Jack is the most appropriate choice here. Face it, Pyro Jack is one of the most memorable FIRE personas. Out of all of the other Personas they could have chosen (Orobas, Hua Po, Dis, Rangda, Jinn, Surt, Mada), they stuck with Pyro Jack because he’s memorable, he’s cool, and he’s popular.
I’m going to make a small prediction right now… I may be right, or I may be wrong, so here it goes:
As Yu forms more Social Links, he’s going to be able to summon Personas from the other Arcana. My guess is that Yu will Summon only ONE Persona from each Arcana. Izanagi from the Fool Arcana, and Pyro Jack from the Magician Arcana are what we have so far. With the inevitable formation of the Chariot Social Link, I’m curious which Persona Yu will summon… This is just a theory, and I could be proven wrong in the next episode!
Short Version:
If the Pyro Jack thing upsets you, I have a feeling you’re just going to get more upset as the show goes on.
@Hornet65: Eeks! You’re right, those we’re Lying Hableries, which do appear in the first three floors of Yukiko’s Castle. I’d completely forgotten about them.
Personally I think Hua Po is more memorable, but I’m a single guy who’s interest is in females (and has a minor xenofetish, the severe opposite of xenophobia), so I’ll admit that I’m strongly biased. Also, after doing a small check in the strat guide the only two Magician Arcana Persona that doesn’t have the fire inheritance type, and thus an Agi series spell available from creation, are Pixie and Jack Frost. Besides, if anyone checked, although I made a comment on it being too soon for a first play-through both P3 and P4 allow you to play the game through again after completing it, and you retain all of the registered Personas when you do so, as well as gaining the ability to summon out any registered Persona regardless of level. Since Agilao would be the strongest Fire element spell that you could reasonably afford to cast at that point Pyro Jack would be the ideal Agi casting Magician Arcana Persona to use, not to mention what other Persona exemplifies the fire element as well as Pyro Jack.
Too me it’s a rather minor point about using Pyro Jack there, and since Shadow Chie is resistant to physical attacks a severe casting focus Persona, such as Pyro Jack, would be better for the fight anyhow. Also, since they’ve shown the involvement of the Social Links, and implied that they need to be strengthened, I highly doubt they’ll show a restricted fusion Persona such as Mada or Loki (Magician and Fool Arcanas, respectively) until they’ve made the “decision” that he’s maxed the Social Link out, I just hope they show the maxing event when they do so. Although, since they’ve had him using a fairly strong Persona rather early I wonder if they’re doing a “second cycle” based story, in which case they can have him eventually call forth Izanagi-no-Okami, and defeat the final boss for the “True Ending” (the game does actually have a “True Ending”, although Izanagi-no-Okami can be created much earlier he is the single most powerful Persona, so they shouldn’t have the only World Arcana Persona appear until fighting the strongest foe, who is fought in the “True Ending” route only).
Hmmmm…I think I’m starting to finally get used to these BBCode tags for spoilers, I’m even being able to remember them well enough to not need the button to put them in.
@Hornet65(most recent post): Hmmm…I’ll go with you’re bet for now (although personally I think they’ll use two Personas from every Arcana except World), but that the Chariot Persona, until we know how many of each Arcana will be used, will either be Ares or Thor. Hard to get much more distinctive with the Chariot Arcana until you go to Futsunushi, but as I said I’m guessing that they’ll ignore the Maxed Social Link Restricted Fusion Personas (as that’s the only way to get them in game, and it can be beat without maxing any Social Links other than the story ones so a player might not have them anyhow) until after they’ve decided that they’ll have had him start maxing out Social Links.
[url=http://www.theanimenetwork.com/Anime/Persona-4/Somewhere-Not-Here/Watch][/url] [b]Episode 04 is now LIVE![/b]
Hmmm…no Avenging Knight special fight? Or Shadow Yukiko summoning Charming Prince to ‘protect’ her during the fight? They’ve definitely started to deviate strongly from the game, although with the way they’re doing the major fights it probably is for the better.
Now that they’ve rushed and saved Yukiko it’s supposed to be about a month until the next person is abducted, so which of the various events until then are they going to cover?
Also, here’s the myth bit for Yukiko’s Persona, Konohana Sakuya:
“Daughter of a mountain-god, Konohana Sakuya is the flower goddess who, in some ways, represents the entire Japanese ideal of life. Her symbol is the sakura, a flower that blooms brilliantly and dies ignominiously within three days, and an enduring Japanese metaphor for fleeting human life. When her husband, the sea-god Ninigi, once doubted her fidelity toward him, she locked herself in a hut and set it ablaze, swearing her children would only be able to survive if they were truly Ninigi’s own.”
Finally, what was with using Ara Mitama for the Chariot Aracana? Yes, I know that Ara Mitama is the mitama of strength, I get the reference point trying to be made. But how many Japanese, excluding those who are Shin Megami Tensei fans, would know enough about the various sets of Japanese mythos to get the point? Both Ares and Thor are nearly as well known in Japan, and unless they’re trying to avoid any of Personas that are taken from the mythos of other countries I don’t see why they didn’t use either of the gods in that Arcana, particularly since they allow all of the Personas to fly if they want to (they don’t just believe they can fly, they know they can) it wouldn’t require Ara Mitama to fly up and block that chandelier.
Now I guess the question is which Persona of the Priestess Arcana is going to make an appearance? Based on the choice made in this ep it’ll probably be Saki Mitama or Kikuri-hime. I’m not familiar enough with the mythos behind the Personas in the Priestess Arcana, but since nearly all of them have the Recovery inheritance type (which basically means they’re meant to be healers) I’m not sure if any of the others really symbolize the Arcana all that well. Of course, if they go with popularity (aka they’ve made secondary merchandise for a Shin Megami Tensei title featuring the Persona that I’ve heard about) then it might actually be Saki Mitama (I think they have made said secondary merchandise for all four of the Mitamas, but I won’t swear to that. Although, if they are trying to avoid Personas that come from a foreign mythos that’s going to force them to completely ignore the Justice Arcana, as Angel, Archangel, Principality, Power, Virtue, Dominion, Throne, Uriel, and Melchizedek are all ranks of Angels, from the Abrahamic Religions (strange name for the group, since if memory serves it’s based around having the story of Noah and the Ark that gets them that designation), and it ends with Straosha, which visually at least still appears to be a part of that group.
I don’t have much else to say, so I’ll just wait to see if anyone else has any comments to make.
Figured Avenging Knight was going to be cut and he was. Would be surprised if any of the mid-dungeon bosses show up now. Don’t really get why Charming Prince was ditched, could have easily been worked into the fight. Chie never used an ice spell the whole episode did she? Don’t remember seeing one. The Shadow Yukiko battle was fine. The episode itself was still a bit boring, though. A lot of back story for Yukiko was added but I didn’t really care about it. Never really liked her in the first place. Good for fans of hers, I guess, but I had a hard time caring about 10 minutes of her running around the Inn and being mopey. Did like that they showed some random fights while they were on the move and talking. Was a good way to handle it, I think.
Anyway, Ara Mitama was a decent choice. The Mitama’s are useful in the game and make good fusion fodder so not surprised it was used. Remember using Saki Mitama a good bit, too, so wouldn’t mind it being used. They may not bother with some Arcana, don’t know. Justice isn’t a party S.Link so it could be expendable. If Justice is out then Devil probably is as well, for the same reasons. Still, would think that it really depends on how much switching they want to do and the like. Probably only going to see it in boss battles, which there aren’t a lot of, so we’ll see. Next Persona seen might be Strength since the next episode seems to involve the sports clubs. Don’t really know what one it could be, though, maybe Kusi Mitama? Oni? Not even going to try and guess on what might be used on how iconic it is and what not. Most of them seem iconic to me having used them all or at least seen them at some point. All I know is if Mara isn’t the Tower Persona it’s going to be a sad, sad day.
To me the Avenging Knight boss fight was significant because he was the first boss where it took something resembling forethought and you needed a decent degree of teamwork to win (it’s the first time the strategy guide recommends putting allies on direct control rather than an AI plan as well, not that I ever left them on AI for long). Although Chie is the first ally to get Bufu spells (Ice spells) she doesn’t get anything after Bufula (rank 2 single target) and Ice Boos, no Ice Break or Ice Amp. She’s a strong meleeist with a small array of supporting spells, not a hybrid (Yosuke, who does get everything Garu, or wind, related) or pure caster (Yukiko, who gets everything Agi, or fire, and Dia, or HP recovery, related) type. Unfortunately the guide has an error in regards to the start stats and spells for Teddie’s Persona, Kintoki-Douji (well, either him or Kanji’s Persona, Take-Mikazuchi, but since you fight Shadow Teddie after Shadow Rise, who’s needing rescued after Kanji, my money is on Kintoki-Douji’s data being wrong), but since no one else has Bufu skills listed it’s probably Teddie who gets them (sorry, never been far enough into the game before to correct the strategy guide on that one, although I’ll probably play that far in, or even complete it for once, while the show is running).
If they stick to just story and party Social Links, and ignore the others, we’ll only get to see Fool, Magician, Priestess, Emperor, Lovers, Chariot, Hermit (starting it is a set event), Fortune, Star, and Judgment (only if they decide to go the Normal Ending route or True Ending route). All of the others involve other people. I doubt they’ll ignore them as the preview did look like it was leaning towards the Sports Club (Strength Arcana) events, and possibly leading into Ai’s (Moon Arcana) events. Now to wait and see just what they do…
[url=http://www.theanimenetwork.com/Anime/Persona-4/Would-You-Love-Me/Watch][/url] [b]Episode 05 is now LIVE![/b]
Personally, I liked this episode… but I have a feeling someone will rage about it anyway. Oh well.
Well, the did hyper compress events in the Strength (Basketball/Soccer Club) Social Link and Moon (Ai Ebihara) Social Link, but personally I rather liked how they got him involved in the sports club in the first place. In the game Ebihara-san always joins as the Team Manager once the Social Link hits Rank 4, but personally I preferred how she already was the Team Manager and some of the players where there just to ogle/be ogled by her. I’m not sure how much of the events for the Moon Social Link are accurate (I suspect they probably are), and technically I can’t speak for the Basketball Club either (I chose the Soccer Club for my current play-through, but that’s because I’m not very fond of how Americans play basketball), but that’s because since I’m not on a second cycle play-through I’m focusing on working Social Links that boost Social Stats (Strength, Sun, Temperance, Devil, and Tower Social Links), and then I work on the ones for my allies (Magician, Chariot, Priestess, Emperor, Star, Lovers, and Fortune, focusing Lovers when she becomes available) because of the combat bonuses they get. Somehow though I have the feeling that, aside from being a different sports club, it’s mostly correct (well, in the game you have to ditch afternoon classes to establish the Moon Social Link, but to me that’s a rather minor difference).
All in all I’d have to say the did a very good job of blending the events of the game with the flow of the anime, and although they’ve taken some liberties with how fast things can progress I’m liking the flow of the anime. I might even add it to my buy list (actually, if the English dubs get the original VA’s from the game it’s already there, but it’s getting close to being enjoyable enough to make it without that). Now to finish getting ready for work.
This is a pretty good series so far(watched the first 3 episodes). I need to catch up later on today.
Slick
I am enjoying this one myself. It is just different enough to hold my interest.
[url=http://www.theanimenetwork.com/Anime/Persona-4/I-ll-beat-you-and-beat-you-good/Watch][/url] [b]Episode 06 is now LIVE![/b]
http://i.imgur.com/CPMZf.jpg. That was all I could hear Kanji saying throughout the entire episode.
Other than that, L-O-L. Funniest episode yet.
For those of us who’ve played the game that photoshopped image is the first thing that comes to mind about Kanji-san. The closest thing to a significant flaw so far is that they’ve hardly done anything with the shrine, and one of the Social Links (story event for it to start, but you have to develop it yourself) focuses on the shrine. This ep was wonderfully done though, and I really liked the Jimmy John’s (I think that’s right) esque delivery. As for who the delivery girl found them, the person who took the order probably heard Kanji in the background and recognized the voice (the Chinese Diner Aiya is just down the street from the textiles shop that Ms. Tatsumi runs) and told the delivery girl to take it to whomever was running from him (it’d be easy to find where he’s making a ruckus).
That’s all I have to say for this ep.
Episode 4
I don’t know these side characters are not doing it for me, Da Vinci is the best of the three so far for me, and awesome twist at the end.
I can’t believe I got the roman numeral part before Kaito, I thought that part was obvious.
[url=http://www.theanimenetwork.com/Anime/Persona-4/Suspicious-Tropical-Paradise/Watch][/url] [b]Episode 07 is now LIVE![/b]
There were some really awesome spots to this ep (unfortunately I’m not that far in my new play through yet, I haven’t been able to work on it for a couple of weeks, though I should get caught up again this weekend), but there was one really noticeable flaw. The Second Arcana is Priestess, though it is Amagi’s Arcana. Empress is the Third Arcana, and is formed with Margaret (the woman who it is translated as saying he’s formed the Empress Arcana when it should be the Priestess Arcana). I loved how Yosuke reacted when Yu asked him if he wanted a copy of Shadow Kanji’s debut scene. I also loved how they brought the Persona Fusion into things (just like I predicted back before the series aired and we just knew that it was coming). Yamato-no-Orochi is a Moon Persona, and Priestess with Magician does result in Moon Persona’s, depending on who the Priestess was supposed to be it was a valid fusion by the games rules (looking in the Strategy Guide High Pixie and Ganga are the only ones that can fuse with Pyro Jack to create Yamato-no-Orochi, and we barely say who the Priestess Persona summoned forth was). In addition, I DO NOT WANT TO KNOW what the ‘liquid’ in those tubs that overflowed was. It was off-color and slimy, I’ve seen enough stuff that TAN wouldn’t run that my first guess is something I’m not going to disgust you guys with, and unless it’s something else I’d rather try to imagine something else than know I was right with my first guess.
Now for the Persona info of Kanji’s Take-Mikazuchi:
“When Izanagi slew the fire god Kagutsuchi with the divine sword Ame no Ou Habari, the holy blood upon the sacred blade created an entirely new god: Take-Mikazuchi, lord of thunder. The patron of martial artists and warriors everywhere, Take-Mikazuchi is remembered for defeating Namazu, the monster catfish that is the source of all earthquakes, by driving a massive stone through Japan itself and the catfish’s body that pinned it down. Ever since, Take-Mikazuchi has had the power to quell the earthquakes that plague Japan through sheer force of his incredible masculine strength.”
A giant catfish monster that causes earthquakes, reminds me of Lufia II: Rise of the Sinsitrals. The second boss of the game was a giant catfish that was causing earthquakes. I will admit that I’d wondered for a long time where that idea came from, and now anyone else who’s played Lufia II can know as well.
I don’t have much else to say, I’m about ready to crash for the night (my new job has me getting up at 0430 local at the latest, and I had a couple of nights where I was up late, relatively speaking, just trying to get to supper because my old job hasn’t completely ended yet), so I guess I’ll just attempt to observe the conversation for a while.
[url=http://www.theanimenetwork.com/Anime/Persona-4/We-ve-lost-something-important-again/Watch][/url] [b]Episode 08 is now LIVE![/b]
