AN Forums

Dubbing Studios discussion

With the departures of Trevor Devall and Matt Hill to LA in 2013, the possible loss of their flagship Gundam series to NYAV Post due to Right Stuf’s (the company that has made a deal with Sunrise to be the future distributor for the Gundam series) close ties with that company, and Viz and AoA not bothering to use Vancouver as an alternative to LA union-contracted dubs (which actually are more expensive than Vancouver dubs and it’s getting increasingly hard to hire Union-only VAs to appear in dubs ever since the recession), are Vancouver dubs going to go by the way of the dinosaur?

I’d like to think not as some of the Canadian staples are pretty cool and I’m not much of a NYAV fan; a Gundam without Brad Swaile is hardly a Gundam.

I’m not sure why Viz has such love for Studiopolis but I wish they’d branch out to other studios as Studiopolis isn’t very good.

Well, Viz loving Studiopolis all began since they dubbed Naruto. I would love to see Viz go back to outsourcing titles to Ocean. As a matter of fact, the same can be said for Aniplex. They seriously need to outsource a dub to Vancouver, given that it’s a better alternative to having it given to the LA unions in terms of price and ease (since it’s getting increasingly expensive and hard to hire union-only VAs to appear in dubs since the recession).
Heck, Sentai has the potential to outsource a title to Vancouver since they have the capacity to outsource dubs to LA and NYAV without too much difficulty (if they could do that with LA and NYAV, then they could do the same with Vancouver).

I think the only way Vancouver dubs can be revived is if Toonami launches in Canada and Sony finally launches Amimax in the states as a 24/7 channel (and with it its Canadian equivalent) and the result is that the anime companies (Funi, Viz, Aniplex and Sentai) would become obliged to outsource several dubs to Vancouver due CRTC requirements concerning Canadian Content.

I’d rather we not get Canadian dubs only because the companies are strongarmed into making them as I’m concerned that being forced into it isn’t good for anyone.

Versus Studiopolis, I don’t believe that there’s a dub studio in CA that could do worse. That said, IME anything recorded at Blue Water Studios gives it Studiopolis a run for its money in the race to the bottom.

As far as I’m concerned, the dub that BWS gave My-Otome needs to be paved over by a Funi dub. Bonus incentive being that Bandai left much of the Otome franchise undubbed so a new dub is rather required anyhow. Say what you will about the Animax dubs, they’re still better than what’s on my HiME/Otome DVDs.

I don’t want companies to outsource to Calgary and besides, I’m talking about Vancouver (Ocean), which is a much more lucrative voice over market than Calgary. I do agree that the My-Otome dub isn’t good and Funimation redubbing it would do the series justice, and that dubs from Blue Water in general aren’t good either.

Anyways, as to why I’m saying that the companies would feel obliged to outsource several dubs to Vancouver if a 24/7 anime channel (it would be a Category 2/B channel since the last of the Category 1/A channels launched in 2001) launches there is because CRTC regulations concerning Canadian Content (CanCon for short) would require any Category 2/B channel to air at least 15% CanCon (at least 4 hours per day) in its first year, 25% (at least 6 hours per day) in its second year, and 35% (at least 8.5 hours per day) CanCon in its third year and beyond (See these pages for reference, which explain regulations concerning Category 2/B channels).

My concern is that if the companies get strongarmed into making Canadian dubs then they’ll go with the lowest bidder and that could give us bad results. Maybe it wouldn’t happen, dunno.

I’d still like to see Vancouver back in the game. They’ve made at least 2 dubs that were and are generally considered TV worthy, and they made the DBZ dub that I’m partial to on top of that. Gotta find a way to twist Viz’s arm until they see reason and get the Canucks back in their dub game.

wanna “revive” Canadian (anime) dubs, then someone up there in Canada should form a new R1, problem solved.
Call it Big Red Studios, Anime Mountie, or Oh Canada

Keep it in the…family!

So what you’re saying is that if the companies would go for the lowest bidder (in this case, Blue Water, which isn’t that good of a studio in terms of dubs) if such a thing happens.

Well, for Ocean to convince the companies that they’re still worth the cost of outsourcing dubs to, their upcoming DBZ Kai dub has to be just as good (if not more so) as the existing Funimation dub. For that to succeed, it would have to be aired unedited and uncut (just like DBZ Kai on Toonami in the states), and that’s where Toonami comes into play (should it launch in Canada, which seems likely since there is Cartoon Network and Adult Swim in Canada and Toonami’s a major success in the states, so it wouldn’t be too difficult for Turner to convince Corus (who owns the channels) to launch Toonami in Canada. For a fun fact, Corus also owns YTV, which aired the Eurocanadian dub of DBZ back in the early 2000s). Also, it’s going to take more than just Viz to revive the Vancouver dubbing scene if they start outsourcing some dubs to Vvancouver again (Ocean would make a good alternative to Studiopolis). Aniplex (it would make a good alternative to the union-contracted fare since it would be cheaper (though more expensive then LA non-union) and have less issues to deal with since the UBCP isn’t as stringent as the SAG-AFTRA), Atlus (since they’re now revived and outsourcing to Vancouver would provide a much-needed breath of fresh air from the usual LA-based fare) and (to a lesser extent) Sentai (they have the capacity to outsource to LA & NYAV without too much trouble so they could do the same with Vancouver) would also have to outsource some of their dubs to Vancouver to truly get it back in the dubbing game.

TBH I wonder why Ocean is doing a dub of Kai as the Funi dub has been established. Also, rumors of the Ocean Kai dub have been swirling for years. I do prefer the Ocean DBZ dub for, among other reasons, their interpretation of Goku and their sense to not cast a very recognizable voice actor as several major characters in the show. If ever I were to buy more of DBZ than I already have, I’d wait for a real bluray release with their dub on it.

It could be interesting if there were a Toonami in Canada and it were to air the Ocean dub of Kai while the US Toonami is airing the Funimation dub of Kai.

Maybe, though AFAIK it is Viz’s patronage that is keeping Studiopolis in the anime game. Looking at the Studiopolis Wiki, every dub listed there with which I’m familiar has been one that I didn’t care for. Of their listed video game dubs, only Psychonauts’ was worthy IMO; the best game dubs that I’ve heard haven’t come from CA. IMO, CA’s voice acting expertise lies in pre-lay work; Outside of that, studios elsewhere have 'em beat and beat badly.

I wish we knew why Unicorn went to NYAV.

The only lyrics to Canada’s national anthem that anyone knows :wink:

Well, back in the early DBZ days, Funi couldn’t afford to outsource to Ocean anymore since the deal between them and Saban (who financed and distributed the series to television, as well as hiring Ocean to dub and was responsible for the edits) fell through by 1997, so Funi decided to go in-house for the remaining episodes. YTV could air the Funimation dub, but DBZ was considered as Canadian Content due to the earlier Ocean dub episodes and that YTV’s a Category A channel (which meant format protection and higher CanCon quotas), so AB Groupe hired Westwood Media (in association with Ocean) to produce a dub for the EuroCanadian market (Funimation’s dub aired in the US, Australia and New Zealand). The Westwood dub, although having higher production values and better-quality voice work, as well has having a very similar script to Funimation’s take, was just as edited as the Saban/Funimation episodes and had a very rushed production, which resulted in many errors in the dub: such as many voice actors leaving the show midway, inconsistent voice direction, and a noticeable decline in quality from the original Saban/Funimation co-production. The original Dragon Ball and Dragon Ball GT also received alternate dubs recorded as Blue Water Studios in Calgary to meet CanCon requirements.
Even after all that, Ocean has decided to make an alternate dub of DBZ Kai aimed at the EuroCanadian market, as shown in episode 26 Trevor Devall’s “Voice Print with Trevor Devall”, which stated that a Canadian dub of Kai is in the works and will be much more faithful to the Japanese track (hopefully, that means it will be unedited and uncut as opposed to edited to death), Kirby Morrow will not voice Goku since he sounded “too cool”, and the Funimation dub was intended only for the US market (though Kai has been picked up for broadcast in the UK on Kix! in early 2013, but will be using Funimation’s dub instead of Ocean’s. It has yet to be aired). In Episode 28 of the series, Paul Dobson has confirmed that it’s Ocean who will handle the alternate dub, and also has stated that there will be numerous recasts (the most notable of which would be Recoome since David Kaye (who voiced him in the Ocean dub of DBZ) has relocated to LA). Lee Tockar had confirmed that he will be voicing Frieza in the EuroCanadian English dub of Dragon Ball Z Kai, and Scott McNeil confirmed at an anime convention that he would be returning to the series. Trevor Devall said in an interview with EverFree Radio that he would do voices for the series. As for its likeliness of this new dub airing on Canadian TV, since YTV swore off anime recently and transferred them all to Teletoon, it would seem that Teletoon would be the place to air the dub (if they want to go for the edited route like what they did with DBZ), but at the same time, the Funimation dub Kai is now airing on Toonami/Adult Swim unedited and uncut, so it would make better sense if they air the Ocean dub of Kai unedited and uncut as well (and that’s were Adult Swim Canada/Toonami Canada comes into play).

It would be pretty interesting if Funimation released a deluxe edition of DBZ Kai that includes both the Funimation and Ocean dubs (as long as it’s unedited and uncut).

[quote=“celestial_being, post:9, topic:7862”]
Maybe, though AFAIK it is Viz’s patronage that is keeping Studiopolis in the anime game.[/quote]

The reason Viz has decided to keep Studiopolis in the anime game is that PCB Productions (a similar studio to Studiopolis in that they have stronger ties to SAG/AFTRA than Bang Zoom!) has been demoted to video game voiceover work (they used to do anime) and Animaze (where many of its talent went to Studiopolis) got less and less voice work due to it being too expensive compared to Bang Zoom! to the point that they went out of business in 2009. Honestly, I would much rather have New Generation Pictures be alive in the LA dubbing scene again than Studiopolis (Funimation would be the best candidate due to their strong ties with that company since many of their talent, such as Patrick Seitz, Rachel Robinson, Carrie Savage, Taliesin Jaffe and Christopher Corey Smith, have appeared in their dubs).

It mostly has to do with Sunrise signing a deal with RightStuf, who has strong ties to NYAV.

Ties that they haven’t been using often enough; I don’t have much interest in sub-only dvds, but RightStuf thinks I should. :wink:

As would I. Though I say that with the caveat that there are only certain types of shows that NGP can dub well. While those shows are few and far between today some similar shows have been picked up by AoA and Funi and, since they have a working relationship, it might behoove Funi to outsource em as not only are Funi’s dubs becoming something of crapshoot in quality but Funi’s weaknesses are NGP’s strengths and vice versa IMO.

That’s somewhat disappointing as I preferred their adaptation of Goku. If it doesn’t at least sound like the same people from the original release, the one that Funimation put out in their Rock the Dragon collector’s edition, then I’m going to be disappointed.

I think NGP can dub more types of shows well. It’s just that their talent is woefully under-utilized, and NGP has let big-name talent in their dubs, such as voiceover veterans Wendee Lee, Doug Stone, Michael McConnohie, Michelle Ruff, Karen Strassman, Stephanie Sheh, and Johnny Yong Bosch, and newcomers like Cristina Vee and Lauren Landa. With that being said, NGP can reach out to get more talents who are pretty much endemic to Bang Zoom! nowadays, such as Erica Mendez, Erik Kimerer, Vic Mignona, Bryce Papenbrook, Christine Marie Cabanos, Benjamin Diskin, Sarah Williams, Cassandra Lee, Marc Diraison, Keith Silverstein, Grant George and Steve Staley.
As for AoA outsourcing to NGP as an alternative dubbing studio, I would much rather have AoA outsource to Ocean, though they could outsource to NGP for more niche titles such as the Monogatari series since NGP would be cheaper than Bang Zoom!. I do agree that Funimation’s dubs are starting to stagnate in quality and outsourcing on a more regular basis would provide a huge breath of fresh air for Funi’s dubbing facilities.

Kirby Morrow voiced Goku in the Westwood dub. Peter Kelamis and Ian James Corlett voiced him in the earlier Ocean dub episodes & movies that are on Funimation’s Rock the Dragon release. For some info concerning who will be the new voice of Goku, Richard Ian Cox will voice him. In addition Scott McNeil will return in DBZ, so we’ll see him as Piccolo and Jeice and others. Also, the Ocean dub seems to have a new intro (and it’s not their take on “Dragon Soul” like Funimation’s dub), and it’s sung by Dave Steele, who also sang the original 1995 Funimation Dragon Ball intro (Gotta Find That Dragon Ball!). Judging by that, it seems Ocean may take the the Westwood route, where the episodes were edited (there’s also hints of a replacement score as well), though Ocean can produce two versions to appeal to two crows, like what Funimation’s doing: one where it’s unedited and uncut (would air on Adult Swim Canada/Toonami Canada, appeal to the older audiences, and also be the one to be released on DVD & Blu-Ray if it gets released), and another where edits are applied (hopefully these edits are like the Nicktoons edits of Kai and not the Toonzai/Vortexx edits. Would appeal to the younger audiences) (would air on Teletoon since YTV has swore off anime).

IMO, the quality of a NGP dub is inversely proportional to the “fanserviceyness” of the show. Funi ought to have brought in Savage and Calvello and done Ikki Tousen in-house and delegated Psycho-pass to NGP but hindsight is 20/20 :laughing:

IMO the issue is that on some dubs they’re putting too many of their new actors in without enough veteran actors to balance the dub out; The originally-released dub of Ben-To and Date A Live come to mind.

The scads of new names that keep popping up in Funi dubs, some actually new and some who have been around for a while, make me think that they might not see a reason to outsource, outside of fan demand for established titles (and even then, there’s always the Trigun/EVA option). As a dub fan I’d rather hear a dub outsourced to a decent studio that uses a balanced cast + solid director than used for the in-house greenhorns en masse to “cut their teeth” on; I don’t want to pay major league prices to attend a minor league game :wink:

I heard of a similar statement on the Funimation forums, where someone suggested that Funi should have had the Psycho-Pass dub done in LA since the dub wasn’t that too good.
Maybe the reason why the dubs of fanservice of shows done by NGP aren’t too good is more likely because of weak direction (most notably, they weren’t directed by Taliesin Jaffe (who essentially is the Mike McFarland of NGP), who directed the Hellsing series and ROD the TV, both of which are some of the best dubs ever made) as opposed to the fanservice itself. I also had a similar sentiment that Funi would in-house dub Ikki Tousen S3&4 since their recasting of Shana was still fresh in my mind, and it was like this until they decided to have both LA & NY talent do the Ikki Tousen S3-4 dub together, which meant having it recorded at two studios (NGP for the LA voice and DuArt for the NY voices). If NGP isn’t the best studio for fanservice shows, then what kind of genres should NGP dub if Funi ever wants out outsource some dubs to?

Taliesin Jaffe seems to me like the guy NGP should have at least writing for their fanservice dubs. I’d like to think that Jaffe is better than McFarland though :wink:

IMO any dub that Funi is putting on the “B-list” ought to be outsourced, even if it is a fanservice show. If Funi isn’t going to give a dub their best then give it to someone else as there’s a chance that it’ll be better and it preserves Funi’s dub reputation if it isn’t.

That said, I’m of the belief that if Funi had done Ikki Tousen in-house that it would have been one of their “A-List” dubs.

While I think NGP would have been the better choice I could see LA doing it too. An LA studio could have assembled the Bebop crew, potentially, and used them in the cast. That could have been interesting, and it would have addressed the complaint that I had when watching it: Kogami, the Spike expy, doesn’t sound like Spike :laughing:

NGP is in the same area as LA just to let you know (the LA dubbing scene consists of Studiopolis, Bang Zoom! Entertainment and New Generation Pictures). I do agree that Funimation should reserve their “B-list” titles for NGP and let their “A-list” titles be in-house dubbed (or if lucky, be outsourced to Ocean, which is pretty much an equal to Funimation’s in-house dubbing facilities).

Here’s how the cast of Psycho-Pass would’ve looked if Funimation outsourced it to California

Psycho-Pass (California)
Shinya Kogami: Lex Lang or Yuri Lowenthal or Steve Staley
Akane Tsunemori: Kari Wahlgren or Lauren Landa
Nobuchika Ginoza: Kirk Thornton
Shion Karanomori: Wendee Lee
Yayoi Kunizuka: Kate Higgins
Shusei Kagari: Tony Oliver
Tomomi Masaoka: Michael McConnohie
Dominator: Laura Post
Joshu Kasei: Mary Elizabeth McGlynn
Talisman: Jamieson Price
Shoko Sugawara/Spooky Boogie: Julie Ann Taylor
Shogo Makishima: Doug Erholtz
Choe Gu-Sung: Steve Blum or Keith Silverstein
Toyohisa Senguji: Neil Kaplan
Jouji Saiga: Travis Willingham
Yuki Funahara: Cristina Vee
Kaori Minase: Mona Marshall
Mika Shimotsuki: Cindy Robinson
Kagami Kawarazaki: Stephanie Sheh
Rikako Oryo: Karen Strassman
Yuji Kanehara: Doug Stone
Masatake Mido: David Vincent
Candy: Stephanie Sheh
Komissa: Mona Marshall
Mitsuru Sasayama: Vic Mignona
Rina Takizaki: Amanda Celine Miller
Nobuo Okura: Michael Sorich
Chika Shimazu: Michelle Ruff
Kurato Goda: Neil Kaplan

And another if Funi outsourced it to Ocean.

Psycho-Pass (Vancouver)

Shinya Kogami: Samuel Vincent
Akane Tsunemori: Kelly Sheridan
Nobuchika Ginoza: Kirby Morrow
Shion Karanomori: Venus Terzo
Yayoi Kunizuka: Anna Cummer
Shusei Kagari: Vincent Tong
Tomomi Masaoka: Scott McNeil
Dominator: Janyse Jaud
Joshu Kasei: Kathleen Barr
Talisman: Brian Dobson
Shoko Sugawara/Spooky Boogie: Saffron Henderson
Shogo Makishima: Trevor Devall
Choe Gu-Sung: Brian Drummond
Toyohisa Senguji: Garry Chalk
Jouji Saiga: Michael Dobson
Yuki Funahara: Chantal Strand
Kaori Minase: Cathey Weseluck
Mika Shimotsuki: Tabitha St. Germain
Kagami Kawarazaki: Shannon Chan-Kent
Rikako Oryo: Rebecca Shoichet
Yuji Kanehara: Don Brown
Masatake Mido: Alex Zahara
Candy: Jocelyn Loewen
Komissa: Andrea Libman
Mitsuru Sasayama: Richard Ian Cox
Rina Takizaki: Maryke Hendrikse
Nobuo Okura: Alistair Abell
Chika Shimazu: Ashleigh Ball
Kurato Goda: Richard Newman

No Swaile? :question:

Yuri Lowenthal? Dunno about that, not for a brooding older (for anime) “badass type” who smokes like a chimney and is fond of hard liquor. Gotta be Blum, the visual and character resemblance to Spike is too great.

Much as I’ve liked the guy in past roles, those past roles are why I don’t see him as this character. Grelle nailed that role. Interesting that you don’t have a Seitz role in there.

Out of curiosity, who would direct? With Sentai and Funi, I’ve learned that the directors matter most for a dub. NGP only seems to have 2 choices nowadays and I only know of 3 NGP directors off the top of my head.

Dunno how much the similarities in the setup matter.

This conversation has reminded me that I haven’t heard that many real (ie: recorded at “Ocean Studios”) Ocean dubs and that Ocean hasn’t made very many such dubs, sadly.

There are some Brad Swaile roles in the Vancouver dub: Melancholia (voiced by Micah Solusod), Koichi Ashikaga (voiced by David Matranga), and any of the extras that are voiced by Johnny Yong Bosch.

The reason why I chose those three (Lex Lang, Yuri Lowenthal, Steve Staley) for Shinya is because they sound closest to Robert McCollum’s performance. Also, I did cast Steve Blum in this series’ LA dub (Choe Gu-Sung, who’s voiced by David Wald, which makes sense considering that David Wald has a very similar vocal range to Steve Blum).

[quote=“celestial_being, post:17, topic:7862”]
Much as I’ve liked the guy in past roles, those past roles are why I don’t see him as this character. Grelle nailed that role.[/quote]

I guess Grant George would make a good alternative if Kirk Thornton’s performance wouldn’t wouldn’t work out according to you.

There is a Seitz role in the LA dub (Nobuaki Kudama).

Judging by actors of the LA dub’s cast, this is most likely going to be a Studiopolis dub as opposed to an NGP dub (with Mary Elizabeth McGlynn as the voice director), and I already mentioned that New Generation Pictures is in the same dubbing area (Los Angeles) as Studiopolis and Bang Zoom!, so I’m not sure why you’re treating NGP as a separate dubbing area from the other LA dubbing studios since the studio’s been known for hiring big-name talents that didn’t start at NGP in their dubs like Doug Stone, Michael McConnohie, Michelle Ruff and Wendee Lee.

Well, isn’t this what this thread’s about: why there aren’t that many dubs done by Ocean since the recession of the late 2000s.

So for a hypothetical CA dub of a series you picked its cast so that it would be dubbed by Studiopolis, the hands-down worst CA dub studio involved in anime dubbing today? :question: :grey_question: :question:

To answer your implied question, because I want to avoid lumping in a decent/good studio with ones that, well, aren’t. :smile:

Where was it in your list?

McCollum was miscast by Funi (as was most everyone in their dub). Also Yuri Lowenthal sounds unlike McCollum in Psycho-pass. Yuri Lowenthal is a west coast version of Greg Ayres, minus the rasp (which puts him further from McCollum than Ayres would be lol).

Cast Spike as the Spike clone, I say. Casting him as anyone else would be a disaster on par with Funi’s GitS: Arise miscasting of The Major as someone else (a show that desperately needed to be outsourced to CA, btw).

IMO, when a dub is outsourced, Bang/Zoom and Studiopolis ought to be out of the running. It would have to be a show that I really liked subbed or have one seriously appealing premise (and the right price) for me to pick up a release with a dub from either of those 2 studios after so many disappointments from them over the years.

I’m trying to be practical here when it comes with casting, and it seems that Studiopolis would be the most likely one to dub the show because of the cast members involved (the only other studio would’ve been PCB Productions, which doesn’t even dub anime anymore).
I guess NGP could branch out and include more big-name talents than usual but they probably wouldn’t have the budget to hire what the cast would’ve looked like in my version since the haven’t been getting that many dubs since the recession (the talents NGP could hire, at best, are: Yuri Lowenthal, Kari Wahlgren, Lauren Landa, Kirk Thornton, Michael McConnohie, Doug Erholtz, Cristina Vee, Stephanie Sheh, Karen Strassman, Doug Stone, David Vincent, Johnny Yong Bosch, Patrick Seitz, Michael Sorich, Michelle Ruff and JB Blanc. The rest would have to be recast, and I don’t know any NGP-specific counterpart as an alternative to the VAs that aren’t listed since many of the NGP-grown VAs have either branched out to work at other studios or have pretty much retired from voice acting and took on other jobs since NGP stopped getting as many dubs due the late 2000s recession and most LA dubs shifted to Bang Zoom! since it was (and still is) the most affordable of the bunch).
Be grateful that California’s still getting dubs to this day even after the recession. It may not exactly be ideal according to you, but try to at least tolerate what LA’s putting out right now.

The reason why I didn’t put the Seitz role in the list was because the character in question was a tertiary character and neither a major nor supporting character.

Funi in-house dubbing GITS: Arise (coincidentally, the show’s dub also had the same voice director as Psycho-Pass), thus completely replacing the cast in order to follow what Japan had done for their version was pretty much an order from Production I.G directly rather than doing it on their own. Also to mention, Animaze (which dubbed GITS: SAC) has been defunct since 2009, and some of the actors may no longer be able to appear in dubs (such as Dave Wittenberg) due to the unions. Even then, the most likely studio to dub GITS: Arise if it was given to California would’ve been either Studiopolis or PCB Productions.

Greg Ayres’s California counterparts would be Bryce Papenbrook, Joshua Seth (who retired since 2005), Matt Hill (moved from Vancouver in 2013) and Benjamin Diskin. Yuri Lowenthal’s and Steve Staley’s Texas’ answer would be Josh Grelle.

If you want to post your own cast of Psycho-Pass, you can go to Behind the Voice Actors and do it on the Dream Casts section of the forum (link)

This thread is dedicated to the current situation concerning the Vancouver dubbing scene, so I don’t want to derail it into something else.